Icarus
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Post by Icarus on Feb 1, 2007 8:31:27 GMT -5
***Originally posted by Jinsei***
A connection with the Force can be felt and worked with if you let yourself attune to it.
To attune yourself to the Force, you must learn to let go and flow with it. Only when you are relaxed, calm and at peace can you act without conscious thought, and this is when you truly make a connection with the Force and allow it to control your actions.
Once you've let go of your mundane worries and fears you can concentrate on focusing your will on accomplishing your goals.
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Icarus
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Post by Icarus on Feb 1, 2007 8:35:40 GMT -5
Icarus said: So, now, I must ask you: Wouldn't you say that for someone to attune themselves to the Force, really, what they have to do is remember the natural state of being? By this, I mean that we are all a part of nature, so have the same attributes of all natural things- including the Force-so, we have to "get over ourselves" and just exist in our natural state in order to attune. I suppose this really has to do with letting go of our own ego, self-important delusions, and that distorted view that somehow, we are separate from all other things. Your thoughts?
Jinsei said: Oh, absolutely. If you're too consumed solely with yourself, then your mind isn't open enough to grasp exactly what the Force is. However, I believe the opposite to be the same as well. If you don't focus on yourself at all, then you won't grasp it.
Here's a way to look at it... take an empty ten gallon fish tank, this is the border of existence. Fill it with water, this is the Force. Place in that a small boat, this is you. Paint one half of the boat red and the other half blue. The red represents everything external from you. The blue represents everything internal. Now, place within the boat enough pebbles that if they were shifted to one end of the boat, it would sink. The pebbles are everything individual in your life (friends, family, emotions, thoughts, etc.). The only way to effectively flow with the Force is to keep everything within yourself balanced, that way the weight is shifted evenly and nothing tries to tip you over.
Our natural state is to be balanced and happy, but things happen to throw us out of balance and we focus too much on one thing instead of another. The human mind is really one of the worst blockages that we have to becoming one with the Force. We simply think too much.
Hachelen said: This doesn't explain the self absorbed, power hungry, or if you like "Sith" portion of the people who can become VERY powerful with the "Force". Once you've touched it and know it's there it can be used in anyway you want. It's up to the user to determine how they will use it and if the karmic response is worth it.
Jinsei said: Actually, while the fictional Sith were powerful, the majority of them weren't actually self-absorbed. Their intentions were for the betterment of society. They truly believed their goals to be noble and the Jedi to be misguided.
Here's where I see the fiction connect closely to Taoism. When you declare something to be good, you automatically create evil, and vice verse. The Jedi had determined that the Sith were evil, and thus began to see themselves as good. They set out to do good things in the galaxy to help bring it peace. In the movies, books, comics, etc. we clearly see that they did this by any means necessary, including killing those that they considered to be evil. The Sith, became determined to rid the galaxy of the Jedi, because they were trying to force their ideals on it. And, so considered themselves to be good, but outnumbered by the evil and oppressive Jedi.
Along came Qui-Gon, who was trained by Master Dooku... who spent time studying the Sith Archives contained within the Jedi Temple. Dooku was trained by Yoda, who is without a doubt one of the most powerful Jedi to have lived. I speculate that through his study of the Sith Archives, Dooku trained Qui-Gon in both sides of the Force, not as seperate sides, but as a whole thing. Was it intentional? I don't know, but I certainly believe it to be the case. Qui-Gon was considered a rogue among the Jedi, as he didn't follow the Council's orders exactly as they'd been given. His concern was placed with maintaining a balance both within himself and with the environment around him. He would withdraw when others would say he should proceed, he would proceed when others would say that he should withdraw. He saw what needed to be balanced and allowed the Force to guide his actions.
We're shown a great example of how he maintained balance in The Phantom Menace. As he, Obi-Wan, and Maul were fighting, they became seperated by the force fields. Maul was trying to fight his way through the field to get to Qui-Gon. Obi-Wan was anxiously awaiting the field to drop that so he could be there to help Qui-Gon. Qui-Gon, who was in between the two, knelt down and meditated. He didn't have the desire to continue the fight, instead he was simply waiting for the next action in which he was called to act.
I know, a lot of people will say, "But, he died right after that!" This is very true, Maul did kill him and his physical body died. However, as we find out in the third movie, he became one with the Force and was able to show Yoda the way to do so also. He was at a complete balance at that point and was able to move beyond the need for his physical body, although he was the first to learn the truth of becoming one. Yoda and Obi-Wan both removed themselves from society and existed alone in the wilderness. I believe this to truly be their crash course in becoming balanced, as there weren't others around to influence their direct environment.
Now, let's look at Maul... he was all aggression and was never trained by Palpatine to be balanced. His sole purpose was to topple the evil Jedi and reveal to the galaxy that there were those who were willing to free them from the oppression the Jedi had kept them under for so many years. He was unable to see the balance and was cut in half, only to fall down a pit. While not being from the movies, in the comics, Maul didn't die in that event. Instead, he laid there in pain and agony until he was rescued and given a cybernetic lower half. He spent the remainder of his days tracking down Obi-Wan with the sole purpose of killing him. Eventually, he found him on Tattooine, but by then Obi-Wan had put into practice the ideal of becoming balanced, and was able to defeat Maul. Granting his final wish, Obi-Wan killed Maul to end his suffering, as he'd been bested by him twice and clearly wasn't as powerful in the Force as Obi-Wan.
How about Palpatine? He studied both sides of the Force and knew that the key to a happy life was to be balanced in them. In theory, he knew how things were intended to be and he had studied the Force from different perspectives, but he was still convinced that the Jedi were evil and that the Sith were meant to lead the galaxy to peace. His personal imbalance led to a greater imbalance for everyone, as he'd gained the power to influence and control such a vast army.
Anakin is a tricky situation, as he was trained by so many different people. Watto, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Palpatine. His training with Watto taught him that there was greed and evil in the galaxy and that the Jedi weren't there to help do anything about it. His training with Qui-Gon was short-lived and thus only a small, but major impact on his life, and one that would show itself many years later. Obi-Wan believed firmly in the opposite sides of the Force and trained Anakin to believe that only the "Light Side" could help him. Palpatine was always there guiding him into believing that the Jedi were corrupt, and later he taught him to focus on the "Dark Side." So, his teachings were so twisted around that he wasn't sure what was true, and he was so imbalanced that he became submissive to a fault. That is, until Luke came into the picture and showed him how things could be for someone who was raised where he was and who hadn't been influenced too far in either direction by being trained to believe that the Dark and Light were the final dividing line. When Anakin realized that Luke was pure in heart, it was a balance that could only come from the happiness that a child can bring. In the end, Anakin was also able to become one with the Force.
So, while the fictional Jedi and Sith were both swayed too far in one direction by creating a division in the Force, neither of them was truly right. There's a middleground that can be reached and as humans we're generally incapable of seeing exactly what that is without training our minds and balancing our bodies. On the other hand, almost every animal is born balanced and prepared to work for the better of society and our planet.
Icarus said: I think that what Hachelen is saying is that there are people out there that would be what some would call "dark-sided." They have been at one with the Force, balanced, etc., but in a moment of passion (which they choose to feel and so throw themselves out of balance with the Force), they understand how to focus that energy to such an extent as to make it a more powerful "attack" or other such thing than someone using pure, balanced Force energy.
It is a momentary thing and afterwards, the user tends to be drained, "down," and reaping the whirlwind of his karmic actions because in the end, the Force is balanced, we are not, and so by our own natures, the energies have to try to balance back out with the energy of the Force.
Now, do I agree? Sort of. I know that the "darker" uses are fast, easier than the patient "light" sided techniques, and can be done earlier for those that are just learning. However, I believe that a person truly balanced with the Force will win-out. They may feel an "attack" or know that there is a "disturbance" in the Force, but because they are truly in tune with the Force, they will know when to act, how to act, and understand that it was the best way to handle the situation. The Force is my ally...and a powerful ally it is!
The self-absorbed part of Hachelen's statement, and my statement, isn't quite as clear-cut as it would seem. The example that you used, Jinsei, shows what we were trying to say better than what we said. The "Sith" may have had good intentions, and they may have saw the Jedi as evil and dominating, and the Jedi did this in reverse. But that is because they couldn't "get over themselves." They were self-absorbed in the certainty that they were right and everyone else was wrong. Qui Gon understood this and acted appropriately. He did what needed to be done, but always with the Force as his guide. He was not restrained by dogmatic straps of either group, though his allegiance went primarily to the Jedi.
So, it is an individual thing that we must do. We should all seek true union with the Force. Does this mean that we cannot work together as a Community? Of course not, but the essence of a true Jedi, or magick-worker, or Taoist, or anyone else is to find the balance within themselves and then act in union with the energy of the Force.
Jinsei said: Like filling a bucket with water and throwing it at someone, then needing to refill it to do it again. Whereas, those in tune with the Force have a garden hose. I'm certain that most who seek it, seek true union. However, where they tend to fail themselves is that they seek only half of it and ignore the fact that it's all a whole. This is like holding a pebble in a closed hand, then looking at the back of your hand and asking, "Where'd the pebble go?" You know where it's at, but you're not looking at the whole of your hand, nor using your senses to guide you to the truth. Icarus asked: "Does this mean that we cannot work together as a Community?"
Jinsei answered: Actually, that should be what binds us together into a community.
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